BackCountry Navigator Forum

Hey... Love the program!  I've had a few small problems in the past that were easy to figure out, or were solved with other peoples posts. All in all, it's worth a little hassle.

Here is todays issue.  I am running an iPaq 5555 with a navman gps sleeve.  I've used all the 1.x versions with little trouble.  This is the second time in a couple months I've tried to get version 2.x to work.  The program seems to run fine, but downloading maps is not working out so well.  If I try to download airial photos, it tells me it cannot connect to server.  Not a huge problem as I don't use them much.  But when downloading topos it downloads fine for awhile then gives me an error...

malloc () failed
out of memory

I haven't found reference to the error before and has me stumped as to whats happening.  I'm downloading to a 1 gig storage card.  It is a large size map, but is the same size as I've done before.
Thanks
Any ideas would be welcome
Lance

It is unlikely that you are running out of space on your storage card. It is more likely that Main Memory is a bit tight. Can you check to see what Program memory is doing.

We don't call malloc in the program, but internet downloads will go through the pocket internet explorer which might. It is true that some have found the software to use too much memory in long downloads. Since memory is automatically managed by the OS, we are looking for ways to force it to use less memory.

Nathan

I have the same problem. I have a 4GB CF card so I would like to get some rather large maps. Have you considered creating a tool to do the map downloads on a desktop? I am downloading right now. My memory is slowly creeping up. Once it gets maxed out I get this error. FYI I am using a Dell Axim X51V w/ WM5. Also I have noticed faster downloads with my CF ethernet adapter than with WiFi.

  Thats always going to be the case - wifi download rates are slower than wired. Thats why many graphics intensive businesses still run cable between networked computers, if I'm understanding it correctly.

I posted a "new feature" request to download maps on a PC... the problem identified on this thread is one very irritating issue.  The malloc() is about main memory (64MB on my IPAQ, 2 GB SD card, 4GB Compact Flash card)... and on my Ipaq 29xx there is nothing I can do about it--all extraneous applications are shut down, the ONLY thing running is BCN.

I'm currently trying to download smaller areas (instead of a 30x30 map, I'm trying to get a 10x10 one)--and so far it appears to be working.  It, of course, means I have to do this 9 times--and hopefully BCN can stitch them together without an error.

Stay tuned on this issue.

We are starting to make some progress on these larger downloads after being stuck for a little while.

The perception is correct that there seems to be a leak of sorts. While memory is automatically managed and there "shouldn't" be any memory leaks. I've seen for these larger downloads that memory is slowly increasing instead of staying about the same as it should.

In more recent experiments to try and force the reclamation of memory, I've been able to get through a 30x30 download okay. While it took a while, it completed successfully without depleting main memory. We'll have to do some testing to make sure the fix is real before we can release it. We are anxious to get this fixed because a PC App solution, despite the convenience it provides, won't be ready quite as soon.   

BCN shouldn't have any trouble fitting together the smaller maps- it's just a pain to do as you've noticed. But you can get the benefit of irregularly shaped maps, another thing we'd like to make easier.

I give up.  Even 10x10's error out when appending to the overall file.  I guess I'll just wait for the fix.  Back to the Garmin 60csx.

2.2.3 has performed much better in tests with longer downloads. It made it through a 30x30. It may be worth trying out for those of you doing larger maps.

I just tried 2.2.3.  It doesn't appear to be downloading my 30x30.  Now, instead of a malloc() error it just sits there with no advancement n the Layer Progress bar.

I'm trying to download 032 45.92183 N 117 0.8095 W  30 x 30 1:1m scale.

I don't have a large enough storage card to try the download you are trying with the 1x1m scale. It could take up to 2 Gig. With the 1m scale enabled, one of the layers has maybe 92610 tiles to download, in which case I'm not surprised if you don't see much movement in a progress bar that only has a scale of 1 to 100%. 

Without the 1m scale checked, I found the download to run unattended and created a file of 97.2 Meg.

2 Gig of data takes a while to download even on a PC. Unless you have a lot of storage space and time, I'd reccommend downloading this large of an area without the 1m scale, then download 1m for more specific areas. You won't get the benefit of 1m scale unless you are zoomed in to closer than the 1000 ft zoom. And it won't affect topos at all.
 

Out of curiosity, I left BCN running since I last posted.  The progress bar *is* moving.  The bar is ordinarily about 3 inches long total... and after roughly 10 hours, the progress is about 1/4 of an inch.  It looks like it'll take a while.  So far no malloc() errors, so I think the main problem is fixed.

Just make sure you only use 1 map file...and the new info will append the old file.

That's what I was doing... and I was getting the malloc() errors.  However, the new version 2.2.3 doesn't get the errors--but the download is s-l-o-w. I'm on day #3 of downloading a 30x30 map... and the progress bar is about 60% done.  I figure in 2 more days, I'll have it.

Nathan... why don't you guys put up a bittorrent (or maybe just an FTP) site so we can upload/download these maps?  Mine is a 30x30 of San Diego--and if other people have big enough SD or Compact flash cards, downloading db3 or BMD files from a site to their PC can save them up to 5 days.  I sure would like something similar for Los Angeles, Anza Borrego, the San Francisco, Washington DC, etc....

Wondering daiichi and Jeepermen. Things cost money to do. BCN for the price we pay is great. Wondering are you asking a lot out of Nathan and his company. Could some things your asking for raise the price????
Love BCN and the price I paid was great. Hope the price does not go up for all the develpments.
Have a great day   Jerry Perch :o

I agree with Fish10. I have never gotten the error do realize there are limitations. I have downloaded a couple of 20X20 (topos only) without problems. To add aerials and the 1 meter would make to that file so large there are bound to be problems while downloading.

If one is not satisfied with Backcountry Navigator there are other programs out there. But try to find any better mapping software for the price.

Fish and Ridgeway... what I'm asking for is that the program doesn't crash.  I can understand a crash if I were REALLY running out of a resource (such as SD or Compact Flash storage space)--but that wasn't the case.  They evidently found the bug and fixed it.

And yes, I am complaining about the slow processing of this--but that is an irritant, not a requirement.  It's one that (I think) can be addressed, and I've even offered to WRITE the software if they'd just give me (obviously under an NDA) a copy of the PPC code and the format of the .db3 file.  THAT won't cost them anything.

In the meantime, it occurred to me that they can address the download issue somewhat if they'd just set up a bittorrent site.  It's going to take me about 5 days to get my 30x30.  If someone wants the file, and Nathan puts someplace for me to upload it to, they can have it in about 4 hours--without having to tie up their PPC for 5 days.  If other people do 20x20's 1m aerials of, say, Seattle, I would be delighted to be able to save myself a few days too.  I concede that a download/upload site may not be useful because, perhaps, I'm the only crazy guy out there that likes to load up BEFORE he goes someplace and finds that cellular reception is intermittent where that geocache is.

I'm so glad you like Topos.  If I were happy with just topos, I wouldn't have spent $30 for BCN--I have a Garmin 60csx with 24K topo maps that is much faster and has a better ergonomic design than my IPAQ (which I have to put in a Otterbox to make it safe to carry rock climbing with me). 

BCN's aerials are so much more convenient because Topos don't show incidental trails.  I've been happy with BCN since version 1.08--and would love to see the 2.x version to be, at the very least, bug free.  Furthermore, I'd like to see new features built into the software that make it easier and more useful to use--there WERE lots of features that made the Garmin much easier to use than BCN.  I'm sure Nathan and crew have the same objectives, or I'd still be running 1.08 and 2.x now provides things that closes the gap like closest waypoint, breadcrumbing, etc.

So, if you're happy with the version you got (bugs and all) by all means, save the bandwidth and don't get version 2.2.3 or 2.2.4, etc.  But don't be surprised that other people are finding issues that need to be fixed.

Not complaining about the program nor the fixes. Love BCN. Where else do you find a program and people that listen to the program problems and then fixes them.. Sometimes fixing a fix causes more problems which in my case has not been a issue with. My problems have come from my ipaq unit itself. Which HP had to fix with replacing the Assy Board. .
So Nathan and company keep up the good work. Thanks for listening to everyones issues.
Thanks again   Jerry Perch

I have not had crashes but work within the limits of the program.

Is there any other program out there that manages large aerial photos or topos for the price of Backcountry Navigator? I have tried GPS Tuner and most of the rest of the competitors. They always come up short. The maps were cumbersome to manipulate and never as accurate those we receive with BN.

If one already has a Garmin unit and software, sure it would be prudent to stick with that. But for someone starting out I would reccomend a PDA and GPS receiver with BN.  With Backcountry Navigator the maps of the entire US are free. (Garmin has topo map sets for over 100 dollars for half of the US. And the 24k sets are very limited)

Backcountry Navigator's tech support is top notch. Nathan has been very quick to respond to the wishes of his clients while keeping costs low.

Thanks to all who have participated in this thread.
 
It appears the original issue of memory usage in long downloads has been resolved.

It can also be noted that while large downloads are possible, the time to accomplish them is certainly not ideal. The ideas for overcoming this include experimenting with PC Downloads and file sharing.

With the current number of registered users(about 150), we don't really have the critical mass to support a file sharing community, at least right now.   

There are some internal reasons why sharing code under nda is not free. I can tell you, though, that if you open a .db3 file in SQLite Administrator, it will tell you all about the format. And the documentation for the web service at terraserver will tell you all you need to know about the calls.

We plan to continue making improvements to the software as long as we believe there is a big enough market for it. If each of you get ten of your friends to buy the software, that will certainly help.  ;)

Follow up on other threads as this one's gotten a bit long.